From: ibis-interconn-bounce@freelists.org on behalf of Mirmak, Michael [michael.mirmak@intel.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 11:15 PM To: ibis-interconn@freelists.org Subject: [ibis-interconn] IBIS Ad Hoc Interconnect Task Group Mar. 26 Minutes and Apr. 2 Reminder ====================================================================== IBIS INTERCONNECT MODELING AD HOC TASK GROUP MEETING MINUTES AND AGENDA http://www.eda.org/ibis/adhoc/interconnect/ Mailing list: ibis-interconn@freelists.org ====================================================================== Next Meeting Wednesday, April 2, 2008 9 AM US Pacific Time Telephone Bridge Passcode 916-356-2663 5 253-5035 Use the LiveMeeting Links in Outlook or the Tiny URL below http://tinyurl.com/2vcelf Unable to join the meeting? Launch the Office Live Meeting client and join the meeting with the following information: Meeting ID: 3053509b0211437f982d4862e2a87b2e Entry Code: wQ7N710B7 Location: meet:sip:michael.mirmak@intel.com;gruu;opaque=app:conf:focus:id:3053509b 0211437f982d4862e2a87b2e?conf-key=wQ7N710B7 Agenda: - Call for patents - Opens - Review of Touchstone(R) 2.0 mixed-mode proposal text ====================================================================== Minutes from March 26: Attendees: ---------- (* denotes present) Agilent - Radek Biernacki*, John Moore, Ken Wong* Ansoft - Denis Soldo* Green Streak Programs - Lynne Green Hewlett-Packard - Rob Elliott* Intel - Michael Mirmak* Mentor Graphics Corp. - John Angulo* Micron Technology - Randy Wolff Sigrity - Sam Chitwood, Raymond Y. Chen, Tao Su* SiSoft - Walter Katz* Teraspeed Consulting Group - Bob Ross* ======================================================================== No opens were raised. No patents were announced. Ken Wong reviewed the extended mixed-mode example distributed to the team. He noted that mixing single-ended and mixed mode had not been done internal to Agilent. The current practice is to print single-ended and mixed-mode data for the same interconnect in different files or even the same file. The standard convention was to order the matrices for one port data ordered as SDD SCD SDC and SCC. Ports with numbers larger than 9 use _ as a separator. Walter Katz requested clarifications on whether the given approach could be applied to a realistic connector case. Ken answered that it could, and added that it also applied to an active differential mixer with LO (local oscillator) and IF (intermediate frequency) mixed-mode pairs as input ports and a single mixed-mode port as an output. Radek cautioned that references need clarification, in terms of association with ports. Walter suggested that additional comments or other information were still needed in the supplied example to identify how the data was collected and how it would be used in simulation. Radek responded that most of the difficulties for the industry still center on having just the data in the file format and how the dat should be interpreted. The original Touchstone was intended for active devices and even the positioning of the rows and columns implied the importance of finding the device's gain. Ken provided additional explanations for the association of instrument ports and device terminals in the example. Michael asked whether both mixed-mode and single-ended data could be placed in the same file. Rob noted that files are already around 1 megabyte with single-ended data. Radek suggested that data could be represented in mixed-mode format only, with conversions required by the tool. Rob noted that some tools don't perform the conversions. If a single minimum data set standard were to be required, Ken suggested it be single-ended, but noted that customers ask for both. Michael asked whether mixing single-ended and mixed-mode interactions for the same ports was needed (e.g., differential stimulus to a mixed-mode port, with response monitored at a single-ended port). Ken replied that it was not expected or treated in any format. Michael stated that a simple set of rules could then be generated for mixed-mode. These will be discussed at the next meeting, if available. ======================================================================== Team Objectives: 1) complete ICM-IBIS linking BIRD and any associated changes to the ICM specification 2) update the ICM specification, if needed, to clarify the mapping of ICM nodes to S-parameter ports 3) complete a specification for "Touchstone Plus" or similar industry-standard definition for Touchstone-like files, to include complex impedance references, removal of limits on the maximum number of ports and per-port impedance references ------------------------------------------------------------------ The IBIS Ad Hoc Interconnect Task Group Mailing List Archives are available at: http://www.freelists.org/archives/ibis-interconn TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send a message to "ibis-interconn-request@freelists.org" with a subject of "unsubscribe" To administer your subscription status from the web, visit: http://www.freelists.org/list/ibis-interconn